8
*rant*
I'm seriously doubting the actual randomness of the RNG on merge. I can't believe how many one two and three outers I get donked on every day. Screw variance, something is wrong with the RNG, I'm convinced. Some of the unbelievable calls I get when playing is just mind boggling. If I'm not playing tighter than my grandmas anus hole, I'm getting donked. Even AA is getting cracked more than 50% of the time against some super crap calls. I'm certain at live tables I'm not going to get the same results.
1 year ago
 - Edited 1 year ago
#1
Aces are going to get cracked more than 50% of the time if all things are correct given its like a 33% hand. I could get into my KK vs AA 92 times so far this year and only winning ONE of those, or my hundreds of 2nd set flopped against top set, or even my aces getting cracked by the worst of 9/4 7/2 a/6 and so on. But the reality is, if you could play as many hands live as you play online and for the same presumably low limits, you would see just as many beats.

It sucks but everyone has periods of run bad cards and it doesnt matter the network as my references above have happened totaled across 4 different networks.
1 year ago
#2
8
KK v AA you had KK? anyway, I disagree. I'm certain that the RNG is just not capable of being random. I'm not sure it's physically possible for a computer to randomize numbers. I'm sure across 20 million anythings everything would even out, but also at a live table I'm guessing there would be less of a propensity for idiots to be playing weird untenable all ins because the people playing would have a better grasp of numbers. So on that basis alone, doing better live seems it would have better odds..

a thing to remember is that the hand when dealt online it is not dealt with a set deck, but with a deck that gets the remaining cards reshuffled after the open, flop, and turn. so no matter how far ahead you are, the "randomness" of a one out, two out situation hitting becomes much less random.

in my opinion.

I know, cry me a river, right?
1 year ago
 - Edited 1 year ago
#3
5654
Admin
I moved thread from "poker club" to "online poker rooms"
1 year ago
#4
I personsally have a very hard time even concentrating in online ring games.. it's much more fun, and you concentrate so much more playing in a live game.. the randomness is legit online, but you see so many more hands per hour that your mind starts to play tricks on you.
1 year ago
#5
3
My idea on this subject is that the shuffler of a deck in computers is one of those things where how random a number the computer is generating is of really little importance. Had to study card shuffling methods in computer classes and a call to the RNG is used once or up to however many times a dealer module might have to go to deck comparing to make sure that a card hasn't already been dealt and then either grabing that card or the next one if it has out of list. The RNG issue really is more of a concern for the Slots.
1 year ago
#6
49
4
Oldstuffman (#3) wrote: KK v AA you had KK? anyway, I disagree. I'm certain that the RNG is just not capable of being random. I'm not sure it's physically possible for a computer to randomize numbers. I'm sure across 20 million anythings everything would even out, but also at a live table I'm guessing there would be less of a propensity for idiots to be playing weird untenable all ins because the people playing would have a better grasp of numbers. So on that basis alone, doing better live seems it would have better odds..

a thing to remember is that the hand when dealt online it is not dealt with a set deck, but with a deck that gets the remaining cards reshuffled after the open, flop, and turn. so no matter how far ahead you are, the "randomness" of a one out, two out situation hitting becomes much less random.

in my opinion.

I know, cry me a river, right?

1 year ago
#7
49
4
Please tell me not true that online the cards are shuffled after the open , flop and turn.
got anything to back this up?
1 year ago
#8
I'll just say one thing about RNG's online you see so many flush draws where as when you're playing live you don't see this that much so with this being said can a computer really randomize numbers to the fullest ? Just a question on your opinion no more no less. Pots

1 year ago
#9
121
6
Thats called heuristic AND IM NOT KIDDING
1 year ago
#10
Well I thought you would be interested in this from PokerStars own website
okerStars submitted extensive information about the PokerStars random number generator (RNG) to an independent organization. We asked this trusted resource to perform an in-depth analysis of the randomness of the output of the RNG, and its implementation in the shuffling of the cards on PokerStars. Information about the results can be seen below.CigitalCigital, the largest consulting firm specializing in software security and quality, has confirmed the reliability and security of the random number generator (RNG) that PokerStars uses to shuffle cards on its online poker site, showing the solution meets or exceeds best practices in generating unpredictable and statistically random values for dealing cards.
“Truly random numbers are the heart of fair online gaming,” said Paco Hope, Manager of Cigital’s Gaming Services. “Our assessment looked at the entire solution, including the hardware and the software, and confirmed that the output of the RNG is cryptographically random and truly unpredictable.” Given the results of this examination Cigital believes that online players should have full confidence that each hand is randomly dealt and the cards being dealt cannot be predicted in advance.
Cigital analyzed the source code, entropy sources and documentation for PokerStars' RNG implementation. In addition, a sample RNG output stream provided by PokerStars was subjected to—and passed—FIPS 140-2 style testing. Using standard methods for exploiting RNGs and having full access to the source code, Cigital found no weaknesses in the PokerStars RNG, concluding that the implementation adheres to the current state-of-the-practice in generating random seed values.
"Cigital's reputation for excellence is well known in the gaming industry," said a PokerStars spokesperson. "Their previous discovery of critical RNG implementation weakness at a major online poker site made our decision to work with Cigital an easy one. Their considerable technical expertise and thorough approach to software reliability and security have established them as a trusted third-party evaluator."
"Building software that can properly generate reliable random numbers is non-trivial, but it is an absolute requirement in the gaming industry," said Dr. Gary McGraw, Chief Technology Officer at Cigital and author of the book Exploiting Online Games. "We are pleased to provide extensive expert analysis of the PokerStars random number generator and act as a trusted advisor. Our analysis shows conclusively that the PokerStars RNG used to generate the poker hands dealt on PokerStars makes proper use of statistically random sequences. A safe and fair gaming environment is an important part of any online gaming experience, and PokerStars meets those criteria."
About CigitalCigital, Inc. is the leading software security and quality consulting firm in the world. Established in 1992, Cigital plans and implements initiatives that help organizations ensure their applications are secure and reliable while also improving how they build and deploy software. Their recognized experts apply a combination of proven methodologies, tools, and best practices to meet each client's unique requirements. Cigital is headquartered outside Washington, D.C. with regional offices in the U.S., Europe, and India.more.
GlossaryEntropy: a measure of a system's disorder or randomness.
FIPS 140-2: a U.S. government standard for implementations of cryptographic modules, that is, hardware or software that encrypts and decrypts data or performs other cryptographic operations. FIPS 140-2 specifies security requirements that are to be satisfied by a cryptographic module used within a security system protecting information within computer systems.
Random Number Generator (RNG): a system, device or module that creates a sequence of apparently unrelated numbers.
1 year ago
 - Edited 1 year ago
#11
121
6
They dont want you to win they want you to spend MONEY I can tell more but you might not believe it. I might be in trouble oops its not against the law in eu enough said
1 year ago
#12
121
6
Yet Ill play there games it fun as long as you no whats going on
1 year ago
#13
I believe some of it comes from that we play a lot of hands online, and therefore there are more chances of players hitting there one-outer. Think about how often it doesn't happen. The only spots the house would benefit from being rigged is in cash games, and I can't believe they don't make enough money as it is, without taking the risk of cheating to earn a little bit more rake. Sorry, but I just don't believe in it

1 year ago
#14
8
Well, I wouldn't call it rigged, exactly, but I don't call it random either.
1 year ago
#15
8
madk9 (#8) wrote: Please tell me not true that online the cards are shuffled after the open , flop and turn.
got anything to back this up?
The best info I can find is that yes, Merge Networks uses a continuous shuffle instead of a set deck, just like Full Tilt did (and presumably still does)
1 year ago
#16
This always seems to be a touchy subject and I guess it is a debate that will continue for as long as we have on line poker. The thing that amazes me is players continually complain about a sites RNG and yet they keep playing there. The only way to check this out for sure is for someone to monitor a very large range of hands and compare the factual results to what should be happening in theory. I certainly do not have the inclination to do it but I am sure if anyone did do ot then the factual would be pretty close to the theory.
1 year ago
#17
1086
9
Why ? Because we are from the USA, we don't have much of a choice in where we play online.I just refuse to deposit on Carbon site.
The thing that amazes me is players continually complain about a sites RNG and yet they keep playing there

1 year ago
#18
Tom1559 (#17) wrote: This always seems to be a touchy subject and I guess it is a debate that will continue for as long as we have on line poker. The thing that amazes me is players continually complain about a sites RNG and yet they keep playing there. The only way to check this out for sure is for someone to monitor a very large range of hands and compare the factual results to what should be happening in theory. I certainly do not have the inclination to do it but I am sure if anyone did do ot then the factual would be pretty close to the theory.
This.

Seems you made a lot of accusations with no evidence. With all the tracking software out there and the millions of hands in ppl's databases, someone would have evidence to support these rigged RNG claims. But they don't. Obviously there are ppl on your side of this argument, but to think you're being ripped off and you still go back day after day is pretty funny imo.
1 year ago
 - Edited 1 year ago
#19
boom247 (#18) wrote: Why ? Because we are from the USA, we don't have much of a choice in where we play online.I just refuse to deposit on Carbon site.
The thing that amazes me is players continually complain about a sites RNG and yet they keep playing there
You realize players make these same claims at just about every online poker site and not just US friendly ones.

1 year ago
#20
8
boom247 (#18) wrote: Why ? Because we are from the USA, we don't have much of a choice in where we play online.I just refuse to deposit on Carbon site.
The thing that amazes me is players continually complain about a sites RNG and yet they keep playing there
agreed
1 year ago
#21
8
oVITOo (#20) wrote:
boom247 (#18) wrote: Why ? Because we are from the USA, we don't have much of a choice in where we play online.I just refuse to deposit on Carbon site.
The thing that amazes me is players continually complain about a sites RNG and yet they keep playing there
You realize players make these same claims at just about every online poker site and not just US friendly ones.
I don't deposit at those either. If I can't freeroll a bankroll I'm not doing it right.
1 year ago
#22
Do we need thread about the same BS everyday. If you cant win just quit poker all together.
Who said poker was easy,,,,,,,,,,
1 year ago
#23
Same ole story, different day!. I read some of the repsonses and the more lengthy responses made my eyes cross.

The system is what it is. If the way the system works bothers you that much my suggestion is just dont play. Bitchin about something/anything never fixes an issue.

1 year ago
#24
!5 out of 100 can feel like 50 if your expectations are that you will win 100%, but I dare to say I know how you feel, and I think everyone else here can relate as well.It just doesn't make sense for a business to risk so much(everything) to make so little (couldn't be much and still remain undetected).
1 year ago
 - Edited 1 year ago
#25
This thread has been locked for new replies.
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