In part one of PokerOrg’s interview with Shaun Deeb, we focused on his intense grind to the 2025 WSOP Player of the Year title and the players left in its wake. Now we look at the drama that kicked off afterward.
Less than a week after the POY title was awarded to Deeb, Phil Hellmuth ignited a fire on X.
“Given a vote by the top 100 tourney players in the world,” posted Hellmuth. “I am certain 90% would have given Grinder [Michael Mizrachi] POY. The last 10% would have given it to Benny [Glaser].”
Hellmuth’s post didn’t sit too well with Deeb — and numerous players and fans who immediately commented on the post, bringing it to over 175,000 views and a load of slapbacks. So what did Shaun really think when he saw it and how did his unusually coherent response come about?
'Ashley read the tweet and went on the f*****g warpath'
What did you really think of Hellmuth’s POY take?
When I first saw the Phil tweet, I knew that there were a couple of lies in there, and that really hurt me as a friend of Phil's. He didn't reach out to discuss any of this with me. If he had just called me, I could have squashed it.
Did you understand his intentions?
I understand Phil’s mindset about people thinking Grinder should have won. But first, let me focus on the lies.
Phil said that a lot of my friends were saying I was embarrassed to win. He spoke with one person, my friend Matt Glantz. Matt told me, ‘There was no way I would ever describe you as being embarrassed about winning POY. I've known you for too long. You've never been embarrassed about anything in poker.’
That's a very true statement. I know people bring up the ladies event and other controversies I've been involved in. I don't shy away from drama, but I also don't care about people's image or opinion of me. That's never mattered too much to me, if at all.
Was there anything else you took umbrage with?
Yes. The other thing was that I had influence regarding the WSOP’s POY rule changes. When I read that, the first thing I did was call my wife, Ashley, as she was out running errands. I told her, ‘I want to give you a heads-up. There's going to be Twitter drama tonight. I'm getting in the muck. You've gotta deal with the kids.’
I told her I was f******g livid about a tweet Phil put out about the POY. She told me to wait to post until she came home.
It’s good to know calmer minds won out for a few moments.
Not exactly. Ashley read the tweet and went on a f*****g warpath, spending an hour constructing our statement. She left out a few things I wanted to say, thinking we shouldn’t make it personal. She organized it way better than I could ever do.
'No one has ever done that'
What got under your skin the most about Phil’s post?
First off, I think Phil is calling me out for having some influence regarding the WSOP POY points format. If he knew anything about its origin, he would realize it came from the formulas used for the WSOP Circuit leaderboards from years ago.
When the format was discussed a couple of years ago, I believed it was a Hellmuth and Daniel Negreanu thing, but now Phil says he had no part in its creation.
Explain the outcome of the top and lower tier scores from this year’s POY leaderboard.
The reason I won POY this year wasn't due to my bottom scores, but rather my top scores. And as far as I know, I'm the first person ever to have three top threes in one World Series. No one has ever done that. Phil talks about all these second places. He never mentioned that I won a tournament. He then said the Poker Players Championship is the second most prestigious tournament. Well, why is that so? Because you value it that way.
You think there are other tougher events on the schedule than the PPC?
Of course. The $100K PLO event had a higher buy-in, more players, and a much tougher field. If you look at the ROI of the best player in the PLO, it's much lower than the highest ROI in the PPC. The PPC has a nine-game mix, so more people don't know all the games. In contrast, the PLO event involved many of the killers of the killers of the PLO specialists.
This is not a knock on anyone who wins the PPC event. I would love to win the PPC or any bracelet. But Phil, in his head, is convinced that that's the most prestigious one. And, you know, 10 to 15 years ago, it was because there were no 25k, 50k, 100k, 250k, NLH, and PLO events.
Things have changed significantly regarding the high roller buy-ins. But the PPC is still one of the most respected events.
It is, of course. And the PPC is still well respected in the mixed game community. But to say it's the second biggest tournament of the summer is just an insult to everyone else who plays the other high-stakes tournaments.
'Phil is still one of my buddies'
How are things between you and Phil? I read Phil’s response. Is everything good now?
You know me and Phil. I can give him some shit now and make fun of him when we get together over the next few months. He's still one of my buddies. He called me a couple of nights ago about something else, and my son couldn't wait to talk to him on the phone. I love that stuff.
Phil’s a good man. He’s got a good heart.
I know where Phil's coming from. I know Phil values bracelets, and he's going to be the leader of bracelets for many years to come.
Do you feel the same regarding WSOP bracelets?
Unfortunately, for people like me, bracelets have become watered down over the last few years. They're more of a placeholder and not the be-all and end-all.
You seem to love the WSOP each summer, no matter what issue pops up.
The series offers recreational players a great experience, featuring opportunities against legendary players, with a chance to win a million dollars and a bracelet. That's the beauty of the WSOP. This year was great. The WSOP app was amazing this year. Jack Effel, Ty Stewart, Andy Rich, and all the dealers and floor guys from top to bottom put in a lot of effort for not a lot of money. The players get the flashy side of the money, but we can also lose a lot of money. The WSOP is a great event.
Thanks for sharing the work you and Ashley put in to respond to Phil’s X post.
Me? I can't take credit. I tried to get more involved when she was composing it. She told me, ‘I’ll reach out to you when I need you. You’re distracting me.’ (laughs) I love the support from my poker friends. So many people messaged me privately, before even the Hellmuth tweet, about how much they respect my grind and my ability to show up and play every day.
You sound like you miss the WSOP grind already.
I know. It's crazy. It's ten months away all over again, but I'm pretty sure that ten months will go very quickly for me. I’ll be there.
You can follow any future dramas with Shaun on X.
